Cinema Scholars takes a look at the new indie crime thriller Red Stone, and sits down with director Derek Presley to talk cinematic inspirations, the benefits of smaller productions, and working with such a cool cast.
Introduction
For the past decade or so, low-budget genre films- particularly indie horror- have enjoyed a sort of renaissance. Filmmakers have not only been able to get their smaller films financed and made, but they also have an ardent audience ready to embrace that effort. A similar trend is now emerging in the world of independent crime/thriller films.
Because of the ever-widening distribution platforms available, an increasing number of smaller productions helmed by lesser-known directors are getting made. Like the indie horror model, many of these low-budget thrillers are attracting fairly big-name actors- sometimes stunt casting for a tiny role to attract better publicity. But more and more, higher-profile performers are taking on the meatier roles and freedom a smaller production offers.
There is so much incredible talent out there, but there are only a handful of starring roles in major studio pictures each year. Many notable actors seek smaller projects where they get a chance to work their craft instead of playing second fiddle in a prestige piece. Thanks in part to this recent kismet, there has been a surge in the number of really good low-budget crime thrillers on the cinematic dais.
Synopsis
The latest entry in the burgeoning genre, Red Stone, follows a classic crime drama trope of finding an innocent character caught in the wrong place at the wrong time. In Red Stone, the unwitting player is Motley (Dash Melrose), a teenager who witnesses the murder of his older brother. Under ordinary circumstances, a person would just report the event to the police. In this case, however, the murderer happens to be the victim’s boss, local kingpin Jed Haywood (Michael Cudlitz).
Motley narrowly escapes Haywood’s henchmen after being discovered as a witness to the crime. With the baddies on his tail, Motley also has to run from Boon (Neal McDonough), the deadly hitman summoned as a backup when the feds get involved.
Like many of these regional dramas, the local vibe gives the well-trodden themes of Red Stone an authenticity that many bigger-budget productions don’t capture. As Motley plays cat and mouse with his predators, locations like a desolate metal scrapyard or an impressive stable of horses give a certain flavor that is tough to imitate on a studio lot or the recognizable Southern California landscape.
Performances
In addition to tapping local resources for his North Texas shoot, Director Derek Presley has also assembled a fantastic cast of accomplished performers alongside some amazing lesser-known talent.
As the notorious hitman on the hunt, Neal McDonough (Band of Brothers, Minority Report) offers his inimitable steely demeanor. While his intensity is aptly intimidating, it’s the hint of increasing doubt around the edge of his seriousness that makes his character more than the typical menacing heavy.
Also adding to the gravitas, Michael Cudlitz (The Walking Dead) appears as the inexorable country kingpin Jed Haywood. Though Cudlitz’s portrayal leaves no doubt about his character’s ruthless nature, the typical tough guy also gets the rare chance to flex as an adoring family man amid all the fury. The actor’s note-perfect duality makes for one fascinating bad guy.
In the newcomer department, Dash Melrose as Motley amazes in a pretty hefty role for a relative unknown. After an arrogant introduction, the young actor gets the chance to show impressive range as his character endures hardship along with dodging bad guys and bullets.
As far as stealing the show, Billy Blair can certainly be accused. Blair’s seedy turn as Hutch, the head henchman, provides the film with the necessary amount of meanness. Ironically, Blair’s portrayal also offers the film a few lighter moments when Hutch becomes a repeated foil for Motley’s continuous evasion. While Blair’s small role filmography is quite prolific, hopefully his latest turn in Red Stone is a precursor to bigger parts to come for the captivating character actor.
Although there are moments in the film that feel indicative of a smaller-scale production, overall Red Stone is a solid little crime thriller with an authentic feel and amazing performances. For anyone looking for more niche underworld dramas, Red Stone is a great title to add to the never-ending “what to stream” list.
Cinema Scholars recently talked with Red Stone director Derek Presley about his crime thriller inspirations, the benefits of smaller productions, and working with such a cool cast.
Interview
Elliott:
Hi Derek. Thank you for taking time to chat with me about your film Red Stone today. I really appreciate it.
Presley:
Oh, thanks for having me.
Elliott:
Red Stone is this great little crime thriller and I see some influences in there but I’m curious, what are your cinematic influences? They don’t necessarily have to be the thriller genre or crime genre, but can you talk about some of your influences and how that works its way into your projects? Or is it just all you… no influences, it’s all original.
Presley:
No. I don’t think anybody’s ever done that! It’s interesting because when I was younger, in my 20s, I started doing short films and my first couple features, they were … And I still love these guys but I like Terry Gilliam and there’s a French filmmaker named Jean-Pierre Jeunet who’s done some great movies. I was into the real surreal stuff, science fiction, fantasy. A lot of my shorts, all of them, were in that… My first two features were that [genre]. And then I took a break from that … Kind of took a break from filmmaking altogether. I came back with a new group of guys, and we said we’re going to try to do another movie, and keeping the budget in mind I was like, “You know, I think I’m going to try that thing people say where you write what you know. I’ve never done that.”
I started like, “I’m going to write what I know and I know this world.” Maybe not gangsters. I’m going to say that one more time- so people know I don’t do these bad things. But I do know that atmosphere. And I know the tone of these things, and I’ve been in it. So, we started doing that, and I’ve always loved those movies. So if you want to know an influence … None of those guys came up in Red Stone, I can tell you that. I didn’t have short lenses like Gilliam uses. I didn’t have crazy set design. There’s no weird, trippy device that steals people’s brains or something.
But I would say probably classic, older filmmakers that I idolize, John Boorman was a big inspiration. He always creeps up in there. And I would say probably … Let’s go Clint Eastwood. Maybe not so much in style or anything but he’s always there. I love Clint Eastwood movies and guys like that. And there are some contemporary guys, too, that I think … I’m really into and I really dig what they do. John Swab’s the guy who’s down in Oklahoma. We actually have some of the same talents and, in fact, we’ve had a couple of the same people behind the scenes involved. He’s a really cool guy. His movies are amazing. And I would say he does that with Oklahoma really well and so that’s kind of there, too, for sure.
Elliott:
You’re based out of the Ft. Worth area, is that right?
Presley:
Yeah. Ft. Worth/Dallas.
Elliott:
Okay, cool. Yeah. I actually grew up closer to you than to John Swab- he’s up in Tulsa. I grew up in Southwest Oklahoma. So, I can feel that Red River influences in there a little bit.
Presley:
And I have family over … And I don’t know geographically where my family, my dad’s side of the family grew up. Elk City?
Elliott:
Yep. Sort of the same neck of the woods! Can you talk about casting Red Stone? Because I think it’s so interesting in some of these smaller films… you obviously have some incredibly seasoned actors with McDonough and Cudlitz, but then you have some lesser-knowns. Dash Melrose is incredible, so great. But then there’s Billy Blair. I just want him to be in everything! Can you talk about the dynamic of working with the more seasoned actors along with the newer faces and how that informs your style? And how they all work together?
Presley:
Well, with Dash … I’ll start off with Dash and Billy. Dash and Billy were in my previous film that we’d just finished and that was my first time working with either one of them and pretty much we were in post on that one when we started developing Red Stone. I had such a great time and Dash, I think, was just … He’s just on the cusp of doing something amazing. He’s got that look, he’s got that style and he’s just a really good human, too. And he’s right there. He’s got a good support group. His family’s very sweet. They support him.
Billy, I had known of him for many years through friends, and I met him a couple of times. One of my earlier films was at a festival. It was also a Comic-Con type thing, and he was there for Rodriguez bits that he’s done.
Elliott:
Yes! That’s right.
Presley:
Sin City and some other stuff. He’s done Machete. We got along really good and after Whitetail … After the last film, I was like, “You know what? Let’s do it again.” And Billy was cast as the lead. He was going to play Boon. And Dash was Motley. And then COVID comes around, stalls our pre-production as it did with everybody in the whole entire world and everything you’re doing. It stopped us dead. Dead in our tracks. And we go … We move into our homes and do the rest of pre-pro saying when June comes around we’re going to start shooting because we’re not going to stop. We’re just going to keep working. And Neal came to us through an agent because we were trying to find Jed Haywood, who’s the baddie. And we thought, “Well, Neal McDonough. He’s one of the best bad guys in the world.”
I wish I could say that that’s a lie. I mean, he is one of the best bad guys in the world but we’re getting picked at. We were thinking somebody else and this person we had in mind really liked it but couldn’t do the script and their agent gave it to Neal. And Neal said, “I don’t want to be Jed. I want to be Boon. Is that okay?” And Billy is a trooper and Billy loved the Hutch role, which is just lots to chew on. And he’s like, “Oh, man. I get to work with Neal McDonough. Whatever.” He’s a team player. He’s like, “Yes, I will do Hutch. Let’s bring in Neal McDonough.” So, we got Neal in there and then Neal got us to Cudlitz because they’re good friends.
Elliott:
Oh, cool.
Presley:
So, that’s really how that happened. Now, working with them, Billy and Dash were more, I want to say … At first, it was much easier for me because they were not Neal and they weren’t Michael. They didn’t bring that through … They were Billy and they were Dash and I know them. I’d just worked with them for a very great shoot that went smooth and we were all very good friends. It’s a little more comfortable.
With Neal, it was … I almost felt like, “Okay, if I’m going to ask for another take I feel a little weird doing it.” But he quickly diffused that and we just moved on and it was professional 100% and he was great. I would say that the biggest difference is that Billy would want to do 50 takes if he needed to and Neal’s like, “I got one to two takes and that’s it.” And that’s because he doesn’t need anything. He just does it. He’s that good.
Elliott:
Right! He just nails it.
Presley:
So was Michael. And they taught me so much. Michael Cudlitz has directed. He’s directed episodes of Walking Dead and I’m like, “Well, I’m going to steal everything I can from this guy.” And Neal’s worked with some of the greatest filmmakers in the business, so for a guy like me who’s doing this movie, I absorbed quite a bit of that and it was really good to work with them. Not to say that Dash and Billy didn’t bring something either but you’re working with some of the people like that and learning. And Dash and Billy were just dedicated to whatever we were doing. They would just do it over and over.
And Dash’s character in Red Stone, the polar opposite of the other character he played in my last film. And he was… I don’t want to say self-conscious but he just wanted to do such a good job that he would be like, “Are you sure?” He would question me. I’d be like, “I’m sure. This is what we want. Don’t worry about it. You’re good.” And that’s all just because he’s …
Elliott:
Learning.
Presley:
And wanting to do the best job that he possibly can and wasn’t settling.
Elliott:
Absolutely. There’s one scene in particular … I guess it’s not a spoiler to say there’s a headshot in it and it’s really good. It looks really realistic. How much do you rely on practical and how much is CGI? Was there more you wanted to do more but you couldn’t afford it? Or do you have some great supervisor who’s like, “Oooh, no. Let’s do it this way.” Can you talk about your process with the effects and how that went down?
Presley:
We had two amazing effects artists. They worked as a team. They did makeup special effects and the effects. The budget was so low we couldn’t do squibs, so we had pumps. Which I’m not a fan of because you can’t… they’re very hard to work with. And another film that we just recently did we had squibs, and the difference is night and day. Blowing up versus a pump shoot and all that stuff. But they did it.
They worked with what they had and did a really good job with that. They know- and it’s a little creepy- they know blood splatter patterns and stuff. “Well, it wouldn’t do this, Derek. If you’re going to shoot his head in, do this?” I’m like, “How the hell do you know that? Nevermind. Don’t answer that question. Just apply your knowledge to the movie. Let’s keep moving, okay?”
But we did have a discussion that we wanted it to be very realistic. We wanted it to be more visceral and we wanted it that meticulous and not the Hollywood explosion effects, which is fantastic in some movies, this movie just didn’t call for it. The head one was a very particular one. The size of the bullet … And Jason Starne, our producer and my post-production supervisor guru …
He’s also one of my business partners. He’s a gun guy. He knows guns very well and so he was very much our… he was on me. When I’m writing a scene and I’m saying something, he would get … “Well, it would be this gun so put it in the script so we can go get it.” And I was like, “Okay, I don’t want a 38. I want a tiny, little bitty one.” And he told me the one. And then he knew it wouldn’t go through the back (points to his head).
Elliott:
Riiiight.
Presley:
This is getting pretty graphic but instead of … Because at first, you’re thinking, “Oh, there’s that window he’s sitting in front of. You could have all that blood.”
Elliott:
Yeah!
Presley:
No, it would just sit there. It makes it worse for the kid, for Dash’s character, and that’s where I said before we started shooting the movie, “We’re in his mind for half of it and we’re in Neil’s mind for the other half. So, that’s it. It’s the two characters. We don’t want to do it but tell me, what would be the worst for you to go through if you’re Dash and on that car, on the blankets …” To see that, I think, is pretty unnerving. But …
Elliott:
Pretty gnarly for sure.
Presley:
There was some CGI. There was some stuff that didn’t work so Jason, again … He does everything. He went in and did some visual effects to just add to what we did.
Elliott:
Right, right. Well, I liked it and I think whatever tricks you used worked really well. That’s so fascinating how those decisions do play into … Like you were saying, the appropriate gun, what the actual fire would look like, and all of that. That’s a great answer to my question.
Presley:
Oh, sorry. I’m long-winded. Sorry.
Elliott:
Oh, no. No. I love it. That’s the best kind of interview! When people don’t talk is the absolute worst.
Presley:
Okay.
Elliott:
You have so many cool locations in Red Stone. You have this cool scrap yard and then you have this badass stable that you can just drive right into and then this ranch house. When you’re writing, are you writing for locations you already know? Or are you coming up with stuff and then you have a location manager whose filling in the blanks for you? Can you talk a little bit about that process and all these cool places that you have?
Presley:
Corsicana, Texas is where we shot it. And since you’re from around here you probably have heard of that place but it’s a little city, a little town. And the chief of police is Robert Johnson. He was our producer on this and he’s done … He’s the chief of police/producer because he’s done a lot of movies. It’s crazy. And it’s like this little unofficial film commission there. So, if you say, “Hey, Robert. We want water for the streets in the opening scene because we want puddles.” “Okay, I’ll get you a firetruck right now. Boom.” “What?”
We’re going to be filming with blanks and we have our standards. We’re very safe. We have everybody for the guns. But instead of having to go through and talk to the residents and the people saying, “We need a permit,” he’ll just come in and let everybody know because he knows everybody. And so we call him and say, “We’re going to be filming that one scene by the railroad tracks and you got three businesses.” “Yeah, yeah. That’s fine. Don’t worry about it. We got it.” “Okay, thanks.” That was amazing. And he was kind of the unofficial locations manager.
And to go back to your question, I would say that… all those are in the script as far as the ranch house and stuff. The scrapyard was supposed to be a junkyard and then, again, Robert was like, “There’s this great place. It’s metal works and it’s all red.” And red is the hue of the movie.
Elliott:
Yes!
Presley:
We tried so that every single frame would have a piece of red in it. So if there wasn’t, our production designer or set decorator would run in there and throw a piece of red in there. Anything. That was really … Again, it was supposed to be a junkyard but that location was so much more unique. It was brutal…disgusting. It was hot…June in Texas and it’s all metal and red and the sun just bounces off of it but it looks gorgeous. And then the barn was originally scripted.
We weren’t supposed to go into the barn with the horses. That was only for a couple of scenes. We were supposed to be on the outskirts of the barn and then what happens is it rains and so we were like, “Well, we need to film it inside,” and then Garrett Schwindt, my cinematographer, was like… DPs are just … Their brains are going crazy with lighting and, “Oh, let’s move to the barn.”
I was like, “Simmer down. Let’s do that.” And it was really good. It’s my favorite scene because of the claustrophobia. Not only is Motley in the back seat but then now you’re a barn.
Elliott:
Right. Ugh!
Presley:
With horses. Yeah. That city… we couldn’t have done it as easy, for sure, and it wouldn’t have been near as good if we hadn’t found Corsicana.
Elliott:
That is so cool. So just find a producer that also basically owns the town. Easy.
Presley:
Yeah. Just the chief of police. That’s easy to do.
Elliott:
Well, I’m probably going to get cut off here any second but I just wanted to ask. You mentioned that you’ve done sci-fi. I notice you’ve covered a couple of other genres, too, but is there a genre that you’re dying to dive into? I guess you’ve done horror, sci-fi, now thriller. Do you have any crazy romantic comedies brewing or any other genre that you’re dying to tackle?
Presley:
No? I guess not. Maybe a proper horror film. I’ve done a horror film but it was a comedy horror. But I’d like to do maybe a real horror film with some weight to it.
Elliott:
Yeah!
Presley:
Something to that effect. But I don’t really know. Sometimes it’s what comes to you. I’m working on another film. It’s a possibility that it will get made next year and it’s a boxing movie. I never, of course, saw myself doing that. But the script’s amazing and we’re hoping it can get made and that’ll be a pretty nice one, so …
Elliott:
Oh! That’s great. Very cool. So the sports film genre!
Presley:
I stopped being so close-minded to things because, like I said, I was so obsessed with a certain style and I really wouldn’t let myself even think about other films. And then later, as you’re getting older you’re kind of like, “Yeah, I think … Yeah, I do want to make a romantic comedy.”
Elliott:
Right. Maybe not just yet. Maybe straight horror and then segue into your romantic comedy.
Presley:
Possibly. But I’d need help with that one. I wouldn’t know a thing about romantic comedy.
Elliott:
I’m not your girl there, either, so no worries! Thank you again and good luck with everything.
Presley:
Appreciate it. Thank you very much.
Red Stone will be available on December 3, 2021, in select theaters, on Premium VOD & Digital.
